Info to turbo
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Some idea for you on what you need and rough prices.
http://www.swappedandboosted.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=20
http://www.mx6.com/forums/2g-mx6-forced-induction/43989-klze-turbo-debate.html
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somehting else differnt to consider!
http://www.balancemotorsport.co.uk/products.asp?subcategory=rear+mount+turbocharging&category=turbocharging
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@b992e456b5=dumplin69:
Lol I have the mx3 1.8 v6 as u can tell I want to turbo it
good start :D
but, you 100% on the turbo, its cheaper and easier although it doesnt sound it to do a klze/klde engine swap.
you will have a 0-60 6'ish second car if you do!
but no dump valve
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lmao yea im sure m8 just wanna get it dne b4 all the shows
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whats your budget then mate, better get ready to drop some serious wonga :wink:
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lol well i am doing the head gaskets,water pump and timing belt, nxt thurs also lol i will be spraying the car to the rs green colour, and i have inquired on here to see if i can have the cobra seats and gages lol so alot lol
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cool, get some pics up and start a worklog, would like to see this coming together
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Surely the compression ratio of this V6 lump would prohibit the effective use of turbo based boost on this car? The amount of work you'd have to do to drop the ratio on a two headed car would probably start to put the job out of economical range. Which side of the lump does the exhaust come out? The inside or the outside? If its the outside then you've got major issues getting that exhaust gas into a single collector to tip into a single turbo. You've then got to get the induction air through some form of filtration into some form of induction cooling system and then into the inlet manifold. The MX3is a car I would consider supercharging but never turbo
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9.2:1 is hardly too high a comp ratio with tuning these days!
Infact that's what I'm boosting right now around 8psi on a KLDE. Prior to that I was supercharged on a ZE at 10:1.
A good running k8 will take over half a bar all day long if it's tuned.
Have a look at my worklog to see turbo mx3 v6 layout. You just use mx6 turbo pipes. It's really as cheap as any other car to turbo. "hardest" bit is probably chopping the xmember and rewelding it.
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Half a bar is firmly in supercharger territory. Half a bar is not IMO turbo territory, a turbo that is effective in that pressure range would be so small as to be pretty pointless for the amount of expense involved in fabricating etc. Most OEM turbo's start out at 0.6 bar minimum and then work their way up from there. When adding turbo's to cars most expect in the region of 1.2-1.5 bar to justify the expense.
To be fair I did expect the CR to be higher on this lump so there is something to work with if you can afford to shell out for some decent fuel control
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lol I guess me spending about £500 on turbo bits and going from 165bhp to 281bhp with just over 0.5 bar is pointless then
I've done both and both for cheap… £/hp a turbo is the cheaper way
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@d57cc3b58b=Marco:
lol I guess me spending about £500 on turbo bits and going from 165bhp to 281bhp with just over 0.5 bar is pointless then
I've done both and both for cheap… £/hp a turbo is the cheaper way
165? I was under the impression the stock engine was 130? Please correct me as a newb if I'm wrong. To gain 70% more power from 0.5 bar is very very impressive. I'll put this into perspective toyota a major manufacturer with huge experience in turbo charging technology can only manage to make 39% power extra from a 2JZ with a very complex sequential system at 0.8 bar. To gain that much more power you need to turn the boost up to 1.1 or 1.2 bar. For sure you can extract 400 bhp from a 2JZ at 0.5 bar by strapping on a T67 but you'll spend a bit more than £500 doing it. Nissan have similar power uplifts with similar levels of boost on their RB range of engines.
What turbo are you using that is soo cheap? What waste gate are you using? Surely you have had to pay for injectors that handle 70% more fuel and a way of controlling that fuel? You'll also need a pump that will deliver the fuel. All of that before you have to strap a bespoke manifold and exhaust system on as I doubt there is an off the shelf option like supra's and skylines. Do you have to change out from MAF to MAP? How are you controlling them there bigger injectors? Who did you pay to map the piggy back, chip, or stand alone ECU? I will be stunned if you can strap a turbo on this car for £500 and maybe a bit pleased as the last turbo I had bearing failure on cost me twice that.
FWIW I think saying you can turbo charge a car and have 70% power gains for £500 is in the least exceptionally missleading.
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I already had self installed standalone megasquirt ECU to control fuel and spark and already had a walbro 255 etc. SO my figure of about £500 is the amount on top of what I already had from my NA tuning and the previous eaton m62 SC I had installed. Though selling the eaton m62 etc probably would have covered most of this! Being as the comparison was of SC and turbo the extra cost was £500 on top of what I already had. Probably half that if I sold the SC parts.
So my core costs were IIRC:
ebay china turbo t3/t4 iirc 57 trim or about that £140
ebay hot pipes £100
clearance tial 41mm WG £140
ICs can be had for <£50
misc turbo parts on the rest
280cc millenia S injectors (though not necessary for low boost, stock 220 safe over 5psi) $100So you can see waiting for the right deals can get you a cheap kit. I reckon I could start from scratch and turbo a 1.8 with megasquirt for <£1k which is a more realistic figure. That'd be without a professional tune, running on base maps or autotuned in tunerstudio. I'm not sure the %gains would be as high on a k8 mind you. Having said that, you could run more boost on the k8 without getting into rod breaking territory like the kl.
My base power was 165bhp which is the claimed bhp of the 2.5 KLDE engine I'm using. KLs love boost. The rods not so much, but they respond very well to turbos. In fact with a decent turbo (eg precision 5758) you can expect more gains than I got, but that would probably double my entire turbo conversion cost. Check out probetalk.com they love boosting the KL.
So I will say for carefully spending 1k you can be well on your way to 70% power gains on a 2.5 swapped mx3. IF you do the work yourself and have basic skills eg welding. The deals you can get on parts for these cars is amazing!
Hope that clears things up :)
BTW who are you? :lol: Introduce yourself on the new members forum :)
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My Turbo install is in the region of £1k also, 323 manifold I picked up for £5! numerous IC's for sub £20 out there, AEM F/IC ECU was about £300. VJ-11 Turbo was £100, clutch is £300, injectors £30, running half a bar that should see me from 110bhp to about 150-160 :D
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@c1a957c347=dangerous:
FWIW I think saying you can turbo charge a car and have 70% power gains for £500 is in the least exceptionally missleading.
It can be if the person reading it looks at that one post and thinks they know all the facts on the subject. (not saying you did this)
Marco has done some damn impressive stuff to his three's, If I was to try and mirror his work, it would cost me a lot more then what it costs him, I'd expect this due to the gap in technical ability alone.
If people want to just look at the words… 70%, Turbo, and £500 then they are fooling themselves and need no help from others who offer personal advice and information from their first\third-hand dealings.
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@18c23136dc=Lori:
@18c23136dc=dangerous:
FWIW I think saying you can turbo charge a car and have 70% power gains for £500 is in the least exceptionally missleading.
It can be if the person reading it looks at that one post and thinks they know all the facts on the subject. (not saying you did this)
Marco has done some damn impressive stuff to his three's, If I was to try and mirror his work, it would cost me a lot more then what it costs him, I'd expect this due to the gap in technical ability alone.
If people want to just look at the words… 70%, Turbo, and £500 then they are fooling themselves and need no help from others who offer personal advice and information from their first\third-hand dealings.
Problem is buddy people do just look at the words and some do indeed think that because someone has said in a post that they got 70% increase on power for £500 (people convince themselves what they want to be convinced about). All in all though I am quite correct in my assertion that you'd be hard pushed to increase a cars power by 70% by turbo'ing it with £500.
As Marco says himself he had the car set up for similar levels of S/C boost, so injectors, fuel pump, and the all important ecu tweakage is normally what would see off at least 50-75% of any boosting budget. Fabrication can see off large lumps of cash which is why most opt for off the shelf kits. I must say I'm struggling to see how a 56 trim turbo is managing that sort of power at such low boost on a 2.5. I will hold my hand up and say I thought it was a 1.8 Marco was on about. The 2.5 conversion won't be cheap either I expect.Sorry for the lack of intro I did one on my HTC but it would appear that didn't post so I will go and rectify the situation now.
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@9d701eff3f=dangerous:
Problem is buddy people do just look at the words and some do indeed think that because someone has said in a post that they got 70% increase on power for £500 (people convince themselves what they want to be convinced about).
Then I wish them the best of luck trying to complete the task they set themselves.
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No worries! Yea I'll happily do a full breakdown in price to anyone that would like it. Though I'd encourage anyone to do their own research rather than reading one post and going "sweet 170% power for £500!!!!!!!"
The dyno printout in my worklog, check it out, though all dynos are different I'm pretty sure it's close.
@b2db72530e=dangerous:
Problem is buddy people do just look at the words and some do indeed think that because someone has said in a post that they got 70% increase on power for £500 (people convince themselves what they want to be convinced about). All in all though I am quite correct in my assertion that you'd be hard pushed to increase a cars power by 70% by turbo'ing it with £500.
As Marco says himself he had the car set up for similar levels of S/C boost, so injectors, fuel pump, and the all important ecu tweakage is normally what would see off at least 50-75% of any boosting budget. Fabrication can see off large lumps of cash which is why most opt for off the shelf kits. I must say I'm struggling to see how a 56 trim turbo is managing that sort of power at such low boost on a 2.5. I will hold my hand up and say I thought it was a 1.8 Marco was on about. The 2.5 conversion won't be cheap either I expect.Sorry for the lack of intro I did one on my HTC but it would appear that didn't post so I will go and rectify the situation now.
